Thursday, February 18, 2010

So what now

Thanks to each and everyone of you. I just have no words. Thanks for all the tips on having a pet, I think Mike is nearly convinced!!! We may go for a small dog, there are many places around where we are that will take it if we go out of the Country, so it's doable!! I'll keep you posted of course.

I read a lot yesterday if it's really possible that my uterus is "unsuitable" for pregnancies like I feared. I found a clinic in Chicago that deals with failed implantation and that has a very informative website on all the known causes of pre-implantation loss, peri-implantation loss and of course post-implantation loss. I'll post it here because it was really helpful
I would be in the category of either pre- or peri-implantation loss. I don't have hormonal issues (ie I do respond to estrogen and progesterone and my lining thickens), I don't seem to have a physical uterine issues (polyps, submucous fybroids or scarring) and I'm dealing with the mild immuno issues with the intralipids. So it could in fact have been the embryos.

"Data from preimplantation genetic diagnosis suggest that 30% to 90% of in vitro fertilized eggs depending on maternal age are chromosomally abnormal. Furthermore, it has been estimated that 75% of karyotypically normal pre-implantation embryos fail to implant."

That's sound like there is a chance that maybe next time we'll be ok! We still got two pregnancies out of 5 transfers (plus one chemical at the second FET), so really we are well within the stats (still it sucks that it didn't work!).
The other thing is the position of the transfer. It's a very fine line and I think given that I don't have tubes any more we may risk a higher transfer next time.

My WTF phone-appointment is scheduled for next tuesday, I'll ask if it's worth my while having a third laparoscopy, to tidy properly the left over stumps of the tubes, remove the external fybroid and perhaps having a look to see if I do have any scarring from my exploratory lap&dye and D&C back in December 07. I'll ask also about surrogacy in Ireland, a friend yesterday said she'll be our carrier...can you believe that? Although I was moved by her gesture I don't think she thought it through and I'm not sure if she would even be suitable (she's 3 years older than me, had hormonal issues in past etc.). Still it was so generous for her to offer.
No calls from the adoption board of course, not sure what to do, if you are seen as an impatient harasser it doesn't really work in your favour!

Overall I feel well, my scientific thirst for knowledge is satisfied for now and I feel more relaxed about our future chances. I went to yoga yesterday and it was great, gong again this evening for a "Goddess gathering" of meditation and positive energy! Just what the doctor ordered!


  1. so happy that you are finding information to help you make the best informed decision possible. it is always wonderful to have people in your life that want to help.

    i need to ask more about this, because i might not have it exactly right. a surrogate i know had something like a lining biopsy before the transfer to help the embryo implant. i will be sure to get you all the details.

    good luck with the dog! furbabies are a wonderful thing.

  2. Girl you inspire me. Being so proactive and positive. Ohm.
    Here's hoping Mike gives in soon. Nothing beats a puppy snuggle. :-)

  3. I also had endometrial biopsies before my IVF cycle to (supposedly) irritate the lining and increase chances of implantation. I didn't do much research on it, but I figured it couldn't really hurt. It was really more a "scratch" than a biopsy though.
    So sorry to see you got a BFN. I really think that it's a positive thing that you've had two pregnancies and a chemical with your cycles. Your embryos did implant, just not inside the uterus where they were supposed to. And somehow I thought ectopics were supposed to be more of an indication that there might be something wrong with tube function (like the little cilia in there not sweeping/moving in the right direction)?
    Hope your doctors have positive things to say next week. I'd tend to think you just fell on the wrong side of the stats, and would hope that another cycle would work the way it's supposed to!

  4. You never cease to amaze me, really Fran. You are so proactive, always researching and sharing what you find. I still am so grateful for your advice in regards to immune protocols I asked you about. I am so, so, so, so wishing, hoping, praying that the next time your babies stick around. I know they will. xoxox

  5. Fran, I think you're doing it exactly right: knowledge, knowledge, knowledge. If one doesn't have all the information, it's impossible to make a decision about next steps. Because you don't have uterine issues, I do think it's likely that the issue was, this time around, the embryos. The vast, vast majority won't be chromosomally normal in any IVF cycle, even in very young women. This is why going with an egg donor, no matter how young, is never 100% either. It's a crapshoot every single time. I just wish the crapshoot had had such a different outcome for you this time.

    I'll be really interested to hear what your clinic has to say, also about what happened with the retrieval, what they would do differently next time, whether they'd advise a third lap.

    We are also sitting on the pet fence. Also teetering:)

  6. Isn't it a great feeling to inform ourselves? There are so many variables out there and it really does help to understand some of them. Even without a medical degree. And your friend was very sweet (if a little quick) to offer to do that for you. It's nice to have friends that want to help, even if they don't realize exactly what they are getting in to. I hope the adoption board calls you soon. I too, hate being a pest and continually calling people so I feel your pain on that.

  7. I am so sorry that this past cycle didn't work out. I am glad that you are researching other areas that may be of concern. I hope that you are able to find all the answers that you need.

    I really hope y'all are able to get a little dog! My big one has been the biggest source of comfort through everything we have been through!

  8. Your attitude is amazing and so inspirational. I think doing research is great. You HAVE to be your own advocate in this process.

    I don't know if anyone else mentioned it, but we had a wonderful experience with the DSPCA here. Of course we adopted the cats, but they have other animals, including dogs, too.

    Thinking of you.

  9. Hi Fran, sorry to hear things did not work out this time. I truly hope and pray that your next round will be it - you are going to do an FET right? I don't think you should give up on the IVF yet, I really believe it will happen for you.

    I think getting a pet is a wonderful thing - we all need our furbabies. They help keep us sane. A small thing to take care of indeed.

    Hugs. xx

  10. I have to echo junebug - you inspire me too!!

    Tell Mike that he must give in - dogs are such delights!! Even Kieran finally gave in with me and now we have three!

  11. My heart cries to hear this Fran! You so deserve better than this! Though I am happy that you are putting all these things together and trying to figure out what can realistically and technically be done! Knowledge is power, and you are headed in the right direction. It's not that IVFs have not worked for you, your major issue has been ectopic... howeever hard it might be to keep going with this... I really don't think you should stop here! XOXOX

  12. I don't have tubes either (rem'd due to endo/hydro) but wasn't aware that the transfer position could be altered for us. I would love to hear more on this as this is all new to me! Please fill me in on this one as I am tranfering on Monday! :)

    Getting a pet is so helpful - after my first failures I adopted two rescue Siamese kittens who have been such a joy to me. Animals give you so much unconditional love, something that is much needed in our lives.

  13. my dear Fran, I'm so sorry that this cycle did not work but glad to hear that you are doing lots of research that is helping you to think more optimistically. the yoga sounds just the ticket. And as for your prediction about your great record with cycle buddies - you were right!
    Sending lots of love and hugs,
    And yes!!!! get a pet. and when you go away take him/ her with or get a pet sitter ( preferable) or board him or her or have a friend take care of him / her.
    Last summer when I was in the doldrums I fostered and bottle fed three kittens that made miraculous recoveries from the brink of death and it really kept me going. They are all in great homes now. ANd of course I still have my two dogs and four foster kitties!!!

  14. Happy Goddess Gathering! Sounds wonderful! I'm glad you feel upbeat about your chances for the next cycle. I just KNOW that one of these times it will work! It has to! You are so determined and some little baby soul is waiting to be your precious child. You are always in my thoughts and prayers. (But a puppy might still be fun in the mean time!)

  15. Fran you are amazing. I don't know if I told you that before, but you are. The resolve to keep going is a breath of fresh air. I love that you aren't just rolling over and taking it. Not only that, but you are taking the hand you have been dealt and playing it well. You pick yourself up so quickly and are ready to move onto the next step right away. You are simply amazing. You have got to be one of the most positive infertile women out there.

    As for pups, I highly recommend them. There is nothing in this world like a good dog. There is a quote that says, "A dog is the only thing in this world that will love you more than himself" and it is so very true. I couldn't live in a world without a pooch. As a famous Western actor once said (I think it was John Wayne), "If dogs don't go to heaven when I die, then I want to go where the dogs go." I completely agree. Heaven would not be heaven without my dogs. They keep me sane, they keep my blood pressure low, and they are ALWAYS, ALWAYS there for me not matter what. They are one of the most rewarding things in life. Can you tell I think you should get a dog? lol

    You're amazing Fran.

    *huge hugs*

  16. You sound soooooooooooo much better today...thank goodness. It's amazing how knowledge can be so empowering, isn't it? It gives us the perspective we need to make decisions and take action. I'm so glad to see that you are nurturing your soul with yoga and meditation, are one smart cookie - you know how to take care of yourself, lady! Can't wait to hear more about your puppy possibilities, too!


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